John Wells on Travis Smiley late night on PBS!
Source：Travis Smiley late night on PBS!
Date：1/8/06
John Wells
Learn more about this guest.
Tavis: John Wells is a multi-Emmy-winning producer, writer and director whose rum includes seminal shows like "E.R." and “The West Wing.” This fall, his latest series debut is called “Smith.” The CBS drama stars Ray Liotta and Virginia Madsen. It airs Tuesday nights at 10:00. Here now, a scene from “Smith.”
[Clip]
Tavis: John Wells, nice to meet you.
John Wells: (Laughs) Nice to meet you, sir.
Tavis: Glad to have you on the program. When I first saw this series coming to television, and I saw Ray Liotta and Virginia Madsen attached to it, not a bad way to start out.
Wells: Uh huh.
Tavis: We tend to think of these folk these days as movie stars, as opposed to small screen stars.
Wells: Yeah, we were, I was very lucky. I was looking for something to do with some of the people that I have wanted to work with in the past, and contacted people before I wrote it. So actually, the show was cast before the series was written. And?/p>
Tavis: Is that atypical?
Wells: That’s very atypical. I was able to pitch them an idea that I was interested in, and get them to say they would be interested in doing it if they liked the script. They had the right not to do it if they didn’t like the script when it was finished. And almost all the cast was put together before I wrote it. So I was able to write specifically for actors, which is the great way to do it.
Tavis: I was about to ask, not being a writer, of course, it sounds to me that that’s the easier way to do it.
Wells: Oh, much, much more so, because you have a real sense of who the characters are gonna be. You know their work. In the case of both Virginia and Ray, I was able to sit down with them in advance and talk about things that they wanted to play, and what they’d be interested in. And we really talked about the characters in advance. And that’s a tremendous advantage when you go into doing it.
Tavis: So tell me about “Smith.”
Wells: Well, I had been writing for a number of years on “E.R.,” and then more recently on “West Wing” about world events, and hunger in Africa. And I was looking to do something that was fun. And it’s a big, fun series about a group of career criminals, and how they live in our own communities. Criminals don’t tend to really live in places that are convenient for us to find them.
They're not really in the Criminal Arms apartment building. They're next door. And it’s about how they're actually integrated into our neighborhoods, and what they do, and how they do what they do. And eventually, the consequences of living the way that they live.
Tavis: Is there a commentary about society in this series?
Wells: I think there’s a commentary about how difficult it is for people to make a living in this changing world, and how people are becoming increasingly frustrated with the lack of support they feel from the companies that they work with, with the people that they work with. And these are people who act out in a way that hopefully, most of society won’t.
Tavis: Yeah. When you say frustrated, you're suggesting, then, it’s the frustration that turns people into criminals in neighborhoods?
Wells: I think oftentimes, it’s the frustration that can turn people into criminals, or at least the sense, and don’t get me wrong, there are a couple of people in this piece who are clearly sociopaths. (Laughs) But it’s the frustration with the sense that I’m not quite sure how I’m gonna get there from where I am. And we’re living in a world in which the standard of living, I think, for most people is going to actually decrease rather than increase, as globalization, as more and more of that happens. And these are some of the things that can happen to people when that’s occurring.
Tavis: Yeah. You, to your earlier point, are very much interested in writing about current events and real time issues. Where did that kind of passion in your writing come from? There are all kind of ways to write in this business, but that’s your bailiwick. Why?
Wells: I was always interested in societal trends, and I’m mostly interested in writing about characters. And I think people are affected tremendously by what’s happening in the world around them. We’re not nearly as isolated as we tend to wanna believe we are as a nation. And so I got very interested in how did the things that are happening to us in the world around us actually affect people day to day?
We're very tied into each other as a community. The society is very complicated. And whether you're a criminal or a doctor or a politician, you actually have to deal with all of the societal things that are going on, that are constantly going on around you. And I got interested in writing about that. I think that’s what, what people as an audience are mostly interested in.
We're interested in the things that are affecting us, moving us, frightening us, and watching people on television or in feature films deal with those issues in a way that we may or may not, but that we can learn something from in watching how they deal with it.
Tavis: Speaking of frightening, “The West Wing” is no longer a part of our ?well, in rerun, of course. No longer a part of our lives in first-run. But I’d be remiss to not ask you, speaking of frightening events, how the White House in “The West Wing” would be dealing with the crisis in the Middle East right about now.
Wells: We tried to deal at least with some of the issues and the ways that that could be addressed a couple of years ago in the show. We never wanted to try and overstate our importance in it, but to just say, most importantly, you have to talk. There’s a lot less faith in this notion of negotiation, and increasingly in this country, we seem to believe that only by exerting power and might do you get to a point where you can negotiate.
Not only my religious beliefs, but my personal beliefs would say that that’s really this wrong way to look at any crisis or situation. Try to find common ground first, and I think if we were doing another year, we would be dealing exactly with this notion of how are we supposed to go into situations where the United States has lost a tremendous amount of credibility as a negotiator or as someone who is perceived to be a fair middleman, and how do we regain that? It’s a huge problem for the country now.
Tavis: Since you went there, let me follow up. To your own personal and political beliefs, what’s your sense ?I agree with you, personally. What’s your sense of how we got away from the value of what diplomacy offers and provides?
Wells: Oh, I think like so many things now in this new century, 9/11 frightened us as a country. And when we become frightened, particularly if you're powerful, you feel like you need to respond in some fashion to a threat. And I think we have over-emphasized the response in military might, and under-utilized and lost a lot of our moral authority to go into situations and discuss how do we find a different way of doing this?
Clearly, and these are my personal beliefs, but clearly, I understood the rationale behind going into Afghanistan, where there was a government that was fostering the people who were trying to harm us. And I find it very difficult to understand what we’re doing in Iraq. And I think we will see that ultimately as a real disaster for America’s stature. I don’t think I’m alone in this (laughs) belief. And it’s a tragedy. I think it’ll be perceived, ultimately and by history, as a tragedy.
Tavis: Let me go back to “Smith” for a second, 'cause there’s a connection here. You and I were talking before we came on the air here about some stuff you were listening to on the radio about world affairs. And you walked in a little depressed, and I was, like, hey, I could turn it off. I do it for a living, and I gotta turn it off, because it can be depressing when it seeps into your psyche and into your system, all the negativity and the fear around the world. That said, does “Smith,” then, allow you to, as a writer, engage in, how do I wanna put this? Some form of escapism? At least you're over here now; you're not dealing with?/p>
Wells: Yeah. It’s actually a relief. (Laughs)
Tavis: Yeah. That’s what I was getting at. (Laughs) I was trying to get to that. Is it a relief at all? Yeah.
Wells: Yeah, over the last few years, I've written extensively on “E.R.” about the Congo, and the situation in the Congo. We’ve done quite a bit about the Sudan last year, and about American healthcare, which is in something of a shambles. And then all of the things we were writing about on “West Wing.”
Tavis: I had Mekhi Phifer on.
Wells: Yeah.
Tavis: To promote that.
Wells: Yeah, when he was doing the Sudan stuff last year.
Tavis: The Sudan stuff, yeah.
Wells: And it’s interesting, the kind of statistics that float around. I don’t remember the exact numbers, but the three hours that we devoted on “E.R.” last year to what was happening in Darfur was actually, I’ve forgotten what the statistic was, more than 10 times what the combined amount on the network newscasts had done that year on the situation in the Sudan.
So I have to say that I was anxious to write something for a little while which just allowed me to just explore character, and not have to deal with world events. And that may be a little bit of me sticking my head back in the sand, but I could use the break. (Laughs)
Tavis: To go back to one of your earlier points, I think, though, you said earlier you didn’t wanna overstate the importance of what you guys did on “The West Wing.” When you talk about Darfur, to your point, you did more time on Darfur than the evening newscast did in a whole year. It got, like, six minutes on CBS for, like, a whole year on Darfur.
You guys did three hours on this thing. So, it’s really not overstating the importance and the power of television, the small screen, when you take those kinds of vehicles and raise legitimate issues for the American public to consider. It’s not overstating it at all.
Wells: No, and I think we can do it, and the trick is always to try to do it in an entertaining fashion, so people don’t feel like they're just being preached to. Because whenever we’re preaching to the choir, I don’t think we’re really making an impact. What we’re trying to do on “Smith” is show some of the problems that people are dealing with, and this’ll come up slowly as the series evolves.
'Cause at the beginning, it’s just a big entertainment, and you're enjoying yourself. But to show the tensions that families are having in just surviving, and these are extreme examples of what people are trying to do to (laughs) survive.
Tavis: (unintelligible) entertaining, though, to your point.
Wells: But it’s gotta be entertaining, but at the same point, we’re trying to illuminate the real tensions that are happening in families.
Tavis: Well, if John Wells is associated with it, you can believe it’s gonna be a hit. The new show, “Smith,” on CBS. John, nice to meet you.
Wells: Pleasure to meet you. Thank you for having me.
Tavis: Glad to have you on. It’s my pleasure. That’s our show for tonight. Catch me on the weekends on PRI, Public Radio International. Check your local listings. See you back here next time on PBS. Until then, good night from L.A., thanks for watching, and as always, keep the faith.
From Travis Smiley late night on PBS!.
Date：1/8/06
John Wells
Learn more about this guest.
Tavis: John Wells is a multi-Emmy-winning producer, writer and director whose rum includes seminal shows like "E.R." and “The West Wing.” This fall, his latest series debut is called “Smith.” The CBS drama stars Ray Liotta and Virginia Madsen. It airs Tuesday nights at 10:00. Here now, a scene from “Smith.”
[Clip]
Tavis: John Wells, nice to meet you.
John Wells: (Laughs) Nice to meet you, sir.
Tavis: Glad to have you on the program. When I first saw this series coming to television, and I saw Ray Liotta and Virginia Madsen attached to it, not a bad way to start out.
Wells: Uh huh.
Tavis: We tend to think of these folk these days as movie stars, as opposed to small screen stars.
Wells: Yeah, we were, I was very lucky. I was looking for something to do with some of the people that I have wanted to work with in the past, and contacted people before I wrote it. So actually, the show was cast before the series was written. And?/p>
Tavis: Is that atypical?
Wells: That’s very atypical. I was able to pitch them an idea that I was interested in, and get them to say they would be interested in doing it if they liked the script. They had the right not to do it if they didn’t like the script when it was finished. And almost all the cast was put together before I wrote it. So I was able to write specifically for actors, which is the great way to do it.
Tavis: I was about to ask, not being a writer, of course, it sounds to me that that’s the easier way to do it.
Wells: Oh, much, much more so, because you have a real sense of who the characters are gonna be. You know their work. In the case of both Virginia and Ray, I was able to sit down with them in advance and talk about things that they wanted to play, and what they’d be interested in. And we really talked about the characters in advance. And that’s a tremendous advantage when you go into doing it.
Tavis: So tell me about “Smith.”
Wells: Well, I had been writing for a number of years on “E.R.,” and then more recently on “West Wing” about world events, and hunger in Africa. And I was looking to do something that was fun. And it’s a big, fun series about a group of career criminals, and how they live in our own communities. Criminals don’t tend to really live in places that are convenient for us to find them.
They're not really in the Criminal Arms apartment building. They're next door. And it’s about how they're actually integrated into our neighborhoods, and what they do, and how they do what they do. And eventually, the consequences of living the way that they live.
Tavis: Is there a commentary about society in this series?
Wells: I think there’s a commentary about how difficult it is for people to make a living in this changing world, and how people are becoming increasingly frustrated with the lack of support they feel from the companies that they work with, with the people that they work with. And these are people who act out in a way that hopefully, most of society won’t.
Tavis: Yeah. When you say frustrated, you're suggesting, then, it’s the frustration that turns people into criminals in neighborhoods?
Wells: I think oftentimes, it’s the frustration that can turn people into criminals, or at least the sense, and don’t get me wrong, there are a couple of people in this piece who are clearly sociopaths. (Laughs) But it’s the frustration with the sense that I’m not quite sure how I’m gonna get there from where I am. And we’re living in a world in which the standard of living, I think, for most people is going to actually decrease rather than increase, as globalization, as more and more of that happens. And these are some of the things that can happen to people when that’s occurring.
Tavis: Yeah. You, to your earlier point, are very much interested in writing about current events and real time issues. Where did that kind of passion in your writing come from? There are all kind of ways to write in this business, but that’s your bailiwick. Why?
Wells: I was always interested in societal trends, and I’m mostly interested in writing about characters. And I think people are affected tremendously by what’s happening in the world around them. We’re not nearly as isolated as we tend to wanna believe we are as a nation. And so I got very interested in how did the things that are happening to us in the world around us actually affect people day to day?
We're very tied into each other as a community. The society is very complicated. And whether you're a criminal or a doctor or a politician, you actually have to deal with all of the societal things that are going on, that are constantly going on around you. And I got interested in writing about that. I think that’s what, what people as an audience are mostly interested in.
We're interested in the things that are affecting us, moving us, frightening us, and watching people on television or in feature films deal with those issues in a way that we may or may not, but that we can learn something from in watching how they deal with it.
Tavis: Speaking of frightening, “The West Wing” is no longer a part of our ?well, in rerun, of course. No longer a part of our lives in first-run. But I’d be remiss to not ask you, speaking of frightening events, how the White House in “The West Wing” would be dealing with the crisis in the Middle East right about now.
Wells: We tried to deal at least with some of the issues and the ways that that could be addressed a couple of years ago in the show. We never wanted to try and overstate our importance in it, but to just say, most importantly, you have to talk. There’s a lot less faith in this notion of negotiation, and increasingly in this country, we seem to believe that only by exerting power and might do you get to a point where you can negotiate.
Not only my religious beliefs, but my personal beliefs would say that that’s really this wrong way to look at any crisis or situation. Try to find common ground first, and I think if we were doing another year, we would be dealing exactly with this notion of how are we supposed to go into situations where the United States has lost a tremendous amount of credibility as a negotiator or as someone who is perceived to be a fair middleman, and how do we regain that? It’s a huge problem for the country now.
Tavis: Since you went there, let me follow up. To your own personal and political beliefs, what’s your sense ?I agree with you, personally. What’s your sense of how we got away from the value of what diplomacy offers and provides?
Wells: Oh, I think like so many things now in this new century, 9/11 frightened us as a country. And when we become frightened, particularly if you're powerful, you feel like you need to respond in some fashion to a threat. And I think we have over-emphasized the response in military might, and under-utilized and lost a lot of our moral authority to go into situations and discuss how do we find a different way of doing this?
Clearly, and these are my personal beliefs, but clearly, I understood the rationale behind going into Afghanistan, where there was a government that was fostering the people who were trying to harm us. And I find it very difficult to understand what we’re doing in Iraq. And I think we will see that ultimately as a real disaster for America’s stature. I don’t think I’m alone in this (laughs) belief. And it’s a tragedy. I think it’ll be perceived, ultimately and by history, as a tragedy.
Tavis: Let me go back to “Smith” for a second, 'cause there’s a connection here. You and I were talking before we came on the air here about some stuff you were listening to on the radio about world affairs. And you walked in a little depressed, and I was, like, hey, I could turn it off. I do it for a living, and I gotta turn it off, because it can be depressing when it seeps into your psyche and into your system, all the negativity and the fear around the world. That said, does “Smith,” then, allow you to, as a writer, engage in, how do I wanna put this? Some form of escapism? At least you're over here now; you're not dealing with?/p>
Wells: Yeah. It’s actually a relief. (Laughs)
Tavis: Yeah. That’s what I was getting at. (Laughs) I was trying to get to that. Is it a relief at all? Yeah.
Wells: Yeah, over the last few years, I've written extensively on “E.R.” about the Congo, and the situation in the Congo. We’ve done quite a bit about the Sudan last year, and about American healthcare, which is in something of a shambles. And then all of the things we were writing about on “West Wing.”
Tavis: I had Mekhi Phifer on.
Wells: Yeah.
Tavis: To promote that.
Wells: Yeah, when he was doing the Sudan stuff last year.
Tavis: The Sudan stuff, yeah.
Wells: And it’s interesting, the kind of statistics that float around. I don’t remember the exact numbers, but the three hours that we devoted on “E.R.” last year to what was happening in Darfur was actually, I’ve forgotten what the statistic was, more than 10 times what the combined amount on the network newscasts had done that year on the situation in the Sudan.
So I have to say that I was anxious to write something for a little while which just allowed me to just explore character, and not have to deal with world events. And that may be a little bit of me sticking my head back in the sand, but I could use the break. (Laughs)
Tavis: To go back to one of your earlier points, I think, though, you said earlier you didn’t wanna overstate the importance of what you guys did on “The West Wing.” When you talk about Darfur, to your point, you did more time on Darfur than the evening newscast did in a whole year. It got, like, six minutes on CBS for, like, a whole year on Darfur.
You guys did three hours on this thing. So, it’s really not overstating the importance and the power of television, the small screen, when you take those kinds of vehicles and raise legitimate issues for the American public to consider. It’s not overstating it at all.
Wells: No, and I think we can do it, and the trick is always to try to do it in an entertaining fashion, so people don’t feel like they're just being preached to. Because whenever we’re preaching to the choir, I don’t think we’re really making an impact. What we’re trying to do on “Smith” is show some of the problems that people are dealing with, and this’ll come up slowly as the series evolves.
'Cause at the beginning, it’s just a big entertainment, and you're enjoying yourself. But to show the tensions that families are having in just surviving, and these are extreme examples of what people are trying to do to (laughs) survive.
Tavis: (unintelligible) entertaining, though, to your point.
Wells: But it’s gotta be entertaining, but at the same point, we’re trying to illuminate the real tensions that are happening in families.
Tavis: Well, if John Wells is associated with it, you can believe it’s gonna be a hit. The new show, “Smith,” on CBS. John, nice to meet you.
Wells: Pleasure to meet you. Thank you for having me.
Tavis: Glad to have you on. It’s my pleasure. That’s our show for tonight. Catch me on the weekends on PRI, Public Radio International. Check your local listings. See you back here next time on PBS. Until then, good night from L.A., thanks for watching, and as always, keep the faith.
From Travis Smiley late night on PBS!.
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